[KB] Your papers
HERBERT W. Simons
hsimons at temple.edu
Wed Nov 14 16:17:39 EST 2018
I'm open to this.
On Wed, Nov 14, 2018 at 3:12 PM Allen Scult <alonso.scult at gmail.com> wrote:
> What we have here is a new way of doing oral history. I was at these
> events as well, and I found myself totally absorbed in the give and take,
> the bits and pieces of people's remembering. As the discourse worked at
> building a clearer and clearer picture
> of what went on, the discourse of the original event (and remember, for
> the most part, these were discourse conferences) emerged out of the fog of
> our shared memories. I think there might be a book here.
>
> Allen
>
> On Tue, Nov 13, 2018 at 9:14 PM Clarke Rountree <rountrj at uah.edu> wrote:
>
>> I was a first-year grad student at the Iowa Conference. It was awesome!
>>
>> Clarke
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 13, 2018 at 5:46 PM HERBERT W. Simons <hsimons at temple.edu>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Dyke, Margolis and Damrosch are first-rate.
>>> Richard was right about the hotel, which had suffered a loss of
>>> reputation due to Legionnaires disease. Richa can tell us all about it.
>>> Dyke and I worked together in a seminar at Temple on Metaphors We Live
>>> By.
>>>
>>> I'd forgotten the caliber of the Temple support group, akin to Iowa's,
>>> and we were all learning together.I recall the intensity of discussion in
>>> the Psychology Seminar room where many of the conferees met for lunch.
>>>
>>> Later, at UIowa, I would meet the Brits McCloskey had invited to the US.
>>> They are far in advance of most of us in their work on SSK, reflexivity,
>>> and the rhetoric of social problems.
>>>
>>> In that period Sage, Ltd published Gergen and Shotter's series on social
>>> constructionism. I edited a Sage series on Rhetoric and Society. (e.g.,
>>> Dana Cloud, Jim Jasinski) ,Simons and Billig) Mick Billig at Loughborough
>>> hosted conferences on feminist rhetoric, language and social interaction,
>>> and discourse analysis.. See also his Cambridge volume, Arguing and
>>> Thinking.
>>> In the past decade Rhetoric Studies took off on the Continent. Kris
>>> Ruten at Ghent can provide details In that period, Margolis and colleagues
>>> held an area-wide philosophy colloquium on a regular basis
>>>
>>> The Iowa Symposium on the Rhetoric of the Human Sciences, which ran for
>>> 5 days was like nothing I'd experienced: 2-3 disciplines (from Mathematics
>>> to LitCrit were featured each day.John Nelson provided a valuable history
>>> of rhetoric's sophistic side which many of us call neo-sophistic. It
>>> complemented Burke's "Traditional Principles of Rhetoric, an underground
>>> history which I drew upon in organizing the Temple conference (Gaonkar,
>>> 1990, in my edited volume, The Rhetorical Turn. Especially valuable for me
>>> were papers by Richard Brown, Barbara Elshtain, and James Boyd White.
>>> This long e-mail may put some of you to sleep, but I'm including it here
>>> before my memory goes.
>>> The young rhetoricians I met at the NCA convention's "Burke Parlor"
>>> should suck it up. I'm hoping that KB journal will see fit to publish it.
>>> For more on my work see my website's writings by Googling my name.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Nov 13, 2018 at 4:40 PM <wessr at oregonstate.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Ed,
>>>>
>>>> I checked my copy of the 1984 program. The conference was at the
>>>> Bellevue Stratford. You're right about that.
>>>>
>>>> Nelson appeared in one of the plenaries. The chair of his panel was
>>>> Charles Dyke. His fellow panelist was David Damrosch.
>>>>
>>>> Bennett also appeared in a plenary. His chair: Joseph Margolis. His
>>>> fellow panelist: Joseph Gusfield.
>>>>
>>>> Your memory may be better than mine.
>>>>
>>>> Bob
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Quoting Edward C Appel <edwardcappel at frontier.com>:
>>>>
>>>> > Bob,
>>>> >
>>>> > I don't remember Burke's interrupting Nelson. If he did so, Burke
>>>> > surely did not launch into a screed against what Nelson was saying.
>>>> > Could that have happened in one of the seminars?
>>>> >
>>>> > For sure, Burke did verbally attack Bennett. I got intersubjective
>>>> > support for that recollection from David Cratis Williams at last
>>>> > year's Triennial. I brought up that example of "feisty Burke" at our
>>>> > plenary "Memories of Burke" meeting. David gave us the "back story"
>>>> > on the matter. Burke was asked his opinion of the papers submitted,
>>>> > this even before the convention began, I believe. Burke said he
>>>> > liked them all except one. Who submitted that one, Burke was asked.
>>>> > "Lance, Lance, Lance," was Burke's reply
>>>> >
>>>> > I remember Bennett looking down at his ms. in obvious embarrassment,
>>>> > as Burke railed on, then, after Burke had got it all our of his
>>>> > spleen, continuing on without a word in response to Burke.
>>>> >
>>>> > We remember the unexpected, the unusual, the harrowingly
>>>> > out-of-the-ordinary,Chip and Dan Heath of Stanford said in their
>>>> > book, Make It Stick. Professor Blasy Ford explained it well in her
>>>> > Senate testimony. There's a rush of norepinephrine and another
>>>> > neurochemical whose name escapes me into the hippocampus in such
>>>> > moments. We don';t forget them.
>>>> >
>>>> > I don't remember who spoke before, or spoke after, Lance Bennett.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Ed . .
>>>> > --------------------------------------------
>>>> > On Mon, 11/12/18, <wessr at oregonstate.edu> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> > Subject: Re: [KB] Your papers
>>>> > To: "Edward C Appel" <edwardcappel at frontier.com>
>>>> > Cc: "Robert Craig" <Robert.Craig at colorado.edu>, "David C.
>>>> Williams"
>>>> > <dcwill at fau.edu>, "HERBERT W. Simons" <hsimons at temple.edu>,
>>>> > p.mass at verizon.net, kb at kbjournal.org, "Fahy" <cdfahy at gmail.com>,
>>>> > "Kathleen Hall Jamieson" <kjamieson at asc.upenn.edu>, "elanah
>>>> naftali"
>>>> > <elanah.naftali at gmail.com>
>>>> > Date: Monday, November 12, 2018, 9:12 PM
>>>> >
>>>> > Hi all,
>>>> >
>>>> > Ed, my
>>>> > memory is that Burke interrupted Cary Nelson. He wanted Cary
>>>> > to
>>>> > explain poststructuralism in a more
>>>> > intelligible way. Maybe I'm wrong,
>>>> > but that is my memory.
>>>> >
>>>> > Bob
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Quoting Edward C Appel <edwardcappel at frontier.com>:
>>>> >
>>>> > > Herb,
>>>> > >
>>>> > > That March, 1984,
>>>> > Conference on Discourse Analysis, under the aegis
>>>> > > of Temple University, was held at the
>>>> > Bellevue Stratford, top floor
>>>> > > as I
>>>> > recall. It was a wonderful event, with feisty Burke standing
>>>> > up
>>>> > > and interrupting Lance Bennett
>>>> > with a blistering tirade in the
>>>> > >
>>>> > middle of Bennett's presentation. Powerful plenary
>>>> > lectures and
>>>> > > excellent seminars. I
>>>> > recall, too, postprandial addresses by both
>>>> > > Jamieson and---forgive me, I'm an old
>>>> > guy, the Burke scholar at
>>>> > > Colorado,
>>>> > his name now escapes me.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > The superb panel speeches last year at
>>>> > East Stroudsburg involving
>>>> > > the
>>>> > young'uns bodes well for the future of Burke studies.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > You and Trevor did a
>>>> > great job on that gathering, and on the book that ensued
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Ed
>>>> > >
>>>> > --------------------------------------------
>>>> > > On Mon, 11/12/18, HERBERT W. Simons <hsimons at temple.edu>
>>>> > wrote:
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Subject:
>>>> > [KB] Your papers
>>>> > > To: "Robert
>>>> > Craig" <Robert.Craig at colorado.edu>,
>>>> > "David C. Williams"
>>>> > > <dcwill at fau.edu>
>>>> > > Cc: p.mass at verizon.net,
>>>> > kb at kbjournal.org,
>>>> > "Fahy"
>>>> > > <cdfahy at gmail.com>,
>>>> > "Kathleen Hall Jamieson"
>>>> > >
>>>> > <kjamieson at asc.upenn.edu>,
>>>> > "elanah naftali" <elanah.naftali at gmail.com>
>>>> > > Date: Monday, November 12, 2018, 8:44
>>>> > AM
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Dear
>>>> > colleagues,I'd like to have e-mailed
>>>> > > copies of your papers.
>>>> > > At the Burke "parlor"
>>>> > > meeting 10-12 young people as well as
>>>> > Roundtree and Thames
>>>> > > convened to
>>>> > discuss matters Burkean. I played the old man
>>>> > > and regaled them with memories of that
>>>> > first Burke
>>>> > > conference: e.g.,
>>>> > the charlatan "doctor" who
>>>> > >
>>>> > attached himself to KB at the Williams conference,
>>>> > moved
>>>> > > in with him, and helped him
>>>> > navigate steps. We registered
>>>> > > him and
>>>> > didn't charge him the entry fee, at his
>>>> > > request.
>>>> > > It
>>>> > turned out that he was a
>>>> > > collector of
>>>> > important people, as our friend, Chris Fahy,
>>>> > > revealed to me.
>>>> > >
>>>> > KB's daughter, Eleanor Leacock
>>>> > >
>>>> > (sp?) was furious at me for entrusting KB to this
>>>> > > imposter. When asked whether he'd
>>>> > like the pseudo-doc to
>>>> > > be moved from
>>>> > his room, he said yes for the man's sake
>>>> > > since he had work to do.
>>>> > > I'd forgotten how many in our
>>>> > > field attended that first conference and
>>>> > participated in
>>>> > > it's small group
>>>> > seminars as well as it's plenaries,
>>>> > > at which a recurrent question was about
>>>> > "not vicious
>>>> > > but mistaken"
>>>> > and the issue of warrantable
>>>> > >
>>>> > outrage.
>>>> > > Note: I've got a book
>>>> > in
>>>> > > production called Rhetoric in
>>>> > Action, which will be made
>>>> > > available
>>>> > at no cost. Several of its essays are on my
>>>> > > website, which can be found by googllng
>>>> > my name.
>>>> > > Psychologist Ken Gergen
>>>> > superintended the project.
>>>> > > Richard
>>>> > Thames recalled that it was
>>>> > > held at
>>>> > the Bellevue Stratford Hotel in Phila but I
>>>> > > recall that it was the Barclay, an older
>>>> > hotel.In deference to KB with his
>>>> > >
>>>> > drinking problem we served grape juice at the banquet.
>>>> > > Kathleen Jamieson's toast:
>>>> > > "Language may do our thinking
>>>> > > for us but it cannot do our drinking for
>>>> > us." As for
>>>> > > the "doc",
>>>> > he spent the night in a bathtub,
>>>> > >
>>>> > compliments of the organizers. On the last night of the
>>>> > > conference, when the KB Society was
>>>> > formed. he approached
>>>> > > Harry
>>>> > Chapin's wife with a hug and she reciprocated
>>>> > > diplomatically, not knowing what else to
>>>> > do.
>>>> > > I can't say enough about
>>>> > the
>>>> > > young scholars who participated
>>>> > in the NCA convention's
>>>> > >
>>>> > "Burke Parlor." For those concerned about the
>>>> > > future of Burke studies, rest assured,
>>>> > this next generation
>>>> > > is highly
>>>> > competent and motivated.
>>>> > > Note:
>>>> > I've got a book in
>>>> > > production
>>>> > called Rhetoric in Action, which will be made
>>>> > > available at no cost. Several of its
>>>> > essays are on my
>>>> > > website, which can
>>>> > be found by googllng my name.
>>>> > >
>>>> > Psychologist Ken Gergen superintended the project.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > --
>>>> > > Herbert
>>>> > > W.
>>>> > Simons, Ph.D.
>>>> > > Emeritus Professor of
>>>> > Communication
>>>> > > Dep't of
>>>> > Strategic Communication, Weiss Hall 215
>>>> > > Temple University, Philadelphia 19122
>>>> > > Home phone: 215 844 5969
>>>> > > http://astro.temple.edu/~hsimons
>>>> > > Academic Fellow, Center for
>>>> > Transformative Strategic
>>>> > > Initiatives
>>>> > (CTSI)
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>> > > KB mailing list
>>>> > >
>>>> > KB at kbjournal.org
>>>> > > http://kbjournal.org/mailman/listinfo/kb_kbjournal.org
>>>> > >
>>>> > > -----Inline
>>>> > Attachment Follows-----
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > >
>>>> > _______________________________________________
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>>>> > >
>>>> >
>>>> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
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>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Herbert W. Simons, Ph.D.
>>> Emeritus Professor of Communication
>>> Dep't of Strategic Communication, Weiss Hall 215
>>> Temple University, Philadelphia 19122
>>> Home phone: 215 844 5969
>>> http://astro.temple.edu/~hsimons
>>> Academic Fellow, Center for Transformative Strategic Initiatives (CTSI)
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> KB mailing list
>>> KB at kbjournal.org
>>> http://kbjournal.org/mailman/listinfo/kb_kbjournal.org
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Dr. Clarke Rountree
>> Professor of Communication Arts
>> Associate Dean for Recruitment and Outreach for the College of Arts,
>> Humanities, and Social Sciences
>> 212D CTC
>> University of Alabama in Huntsville
>> Huntsville, AL 35899
>> 256-824-6646
>> clarke.rountree at uah.edu
>>
>
--
Herbert W. Simons, Ph.D.
Emeritus Professor of Communication
Dep't of Strategic Communication, Weiss Hall 215
Temple University, Philadelphia 19122
Home phone: 215 844 5969
http://astro.temple.edu/~hsimons
Academic Fellow, Center for Transformative Strategic Initiatives (CTSI)
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